Talk:Crafting Items

Images

Holding area for images. It should go up somewhere, but not yet decided on how and where. HG server image means it has not been uploaded elsewhere as yet. -- Grexx 07:59, 12 September 2009 (UTC)

Another column could be made--Stinson 19:29, 12 September 2009 (UTC)

I played with the idea of another column, but I was thinking that unless the developers actually give us image upload capabilities, it would be quite ugly to have a column called images and then just have links there. Sort of points out the lack of images I think. But the thing is I really dislike dumping all the images at the bottom like what's being done on some of the other pages, especially if the list is long. So still thinking of a better solution... -- Grexx 20:29, 12 September 2009 (UTC)

I think might settle for a simple table at the bottom, under images as a subsection under contents. It'll contain 5 alphabets per row (19 alphabets being used now). That should compress the height somewhat, and provide a easily searchable list. So it'll be something like:

Example Table

Table has been moved to the main article itself to avoid confusion on where to update links to. -- Grexx 20:56, 26 September 2009 (UTC)

Table is completed, but the number of missing images is way too high to put it onto the main article. Going to need quite a fair bit of assistance on this. -- Grexx 17:47, 13 September 2009 (UTC)

Can someone check if store bought items from the General Stores have higher resolution images available, in a manner similar to the Cheese images, where inventory images are of smaller resolution as compared to the images available in the Cheese Shoppe. If there are, the image links here should be updated with the higher resolution images as much as possible. The image list is almost done too. It should be ready to be moved into the main article. This will be done after we confirm the image resolution. Either way, the section can go up first, since the images aren't really as vital as Mice and Trap images. -- Grexx 17:00, 17 September 2009 (UTC)

Meteorite Piece

The external link to this image is broken or no longer valid. Can anyone replace it? In the meantime I'll unlink it. Thanks. Joseph 02:49, 30 September 2009 (UTC)

Here's a link to the meteorite image on MH servers (needs to be uploaded soemwhere else): Meteorite Piece. Also here's a Frozen Scroll (also needs to be uploaded elsewhere. -- Camomiletea 19:46, 30 September 2009 (UTC)

Splitting of Table

There's a need to split the table into General Crafting Items and Event Limited Crafting Items (or whatever name is more appropriate) to reduce clutter somewhat. Event Limited Crafting Items will hold any item that appears in the Crafting Items drop-down list, and as the description says, will contain the list of items that are available only during events. In the event that the item is subsequently available as a normal drop (ie Coal), it will be moved back into the General Crafting Items table.

Appreciate if someone can take this up, since I'm short of time to work on this. Most of the items to be included in the Event Limited Crafting Items have just recently been released. Redirects need to be adjusted for those currently pointing to the Festive Gift Shoppe. -- Grexx 16:29, 13 December 2009 (UTC)

I would suggest a separate section for these items' images as well. --B.Rossow • talk 18:04, 13 December 2009 (UTC)

I added the separate table; but not sure if Mistletoe and Christmas Coal should be in there too, since I don't have those items... -- Camomiletea 18:15, 13 December 2009 (UTC)

At this point, no. They aren't listed as crafting items in the Inventory. --B.Rossow • talk 18:23, 13 December 2009 (UTC)

That's not conclusive, e.g. Greeting Card is also not listed in the crafting items in the Inventory but it appears in the drop-down menu for crafting. I guess I'm going to try to obtain these two items to verify. -- Camomiletea 18:26, 13 December 2009 (UTC)

Good point. :-) FWIW, I have all of the items and all appear in the drop-down except the Santa Bear and the Slightly Smaller Gift. --B.Rossow • talk 18:29, 13 December 2009 (UTC)

Thanks for the help with splitting it out. I've done some further adjustments to the items that were missed out as well as splitting the images, so it should be much clearer now. Let me know if there's any more suggestions for improvements :) -- Grexx 14:55, 14 December 2009 (UTC)

Great Winter Hunt '09 items

So now that we know that the 12 Christmas items and the gifted items are not going to be used for crafting, should they remain here? I'm not sure where they would go otherwise. A new miscellaneous/gifts page? --Hyperchao 17:45, 25 December 2009 (UTC)

Or were only the new set of expensive gifts (e.g. gold bar) verified to be decorative? --Hyperchao 17:47, 25 December 2009 (UTC)

The reasoning why these items were placed here is that when you go to Crafting page, and pull down the menu of available ingredients, they are there. Even the items that the devs confirmed had no use (which was only the last batch with the gold brick). Note also that Egg Nog which is part of the 12 items still remains after the exchange. I would suggest keeping them here. They are separated from the other crafting items anyway in the Limited section, and I think that's enough (rather than having them on a separate page). -- Camomiletea 21:18, 25 December 2009 (UTC)

Ah. Didn't check the crafting ingredient list. Only checked the items shown on the crafting page. --Hyperchao 21:58, 25 December 2009 (UTC)

Categorization of Novelty Items

This discussion was initially started in Talk:Teddy Bear. It has been moved as a whole into this more general talk page. The last discussion could be found here. -- Grexx

Since there are now more and more items like this one (Teddy Bear, Santa Bear, Slap Cat, Toy Ronza Ship); I think we need a category for them or a single page on which all could be listed... Don't know what would be a good name. -- Camomiletea 00:27, 24 December 2009 (UTC)

Comfort and Hope? Pus 00:49, 24 December 2009 (UTC)

Flavour/Flavor Items. There's a number of them, most of the items sold in the Festive Gift Shoppe are just there for flavour and not for crafting, even if they do fall under crafting items. It's certainly up for more discussion though. -- Grexx 10:30, 24 December 2009 (UTC)

Novelty Collectables. This is from the Developers in the last minute Christmas shopping news post. "All the new items are entirely novelty collectables" -- Ralphminer 12:30, 24 December 2009 (UTC)

I would recommend using a category rather than a page - since a hunter does not need to compare them. -- Ralphminer 12:32, 24 December 2009 (UTC)

I think it would be good if it were centralized like Crafting Items and Cheese, which makes it easy to keep track of, as well as clearing any confusion there might be about the usage of these items. There are 2 categories at the moment, clickables and non-clickables. We could probably create a new article Novelty Collectables and point the various items there, including Gold Bricks etc. One look and players will know that the items have no practical usage. If we do decide on Novelty Collectables, we'll need to remember a redirect on Novelty Collectibles, as both are acceptable variants. -- Grexx 17:38, 2 January 2010 (UTC)

Do we know that they are all novelty collectibles though? I know that the last wave of holiday gifts were confirmed to be useless in terms of crafting, but as far as I'm aware that's the only info we have. Are we sure, for instance, that the Teddy Bear is useless? -- Doogleface 18:45, 2 January 2010 (UTC)

Regardless of the usefulness of the item, most of them certainly qualify as Novelty Collectables. A remark can be easily made about the fact that whether it works or not is unknown, and best left to the player's imagination. One way around this is to have another Novelty Item section in Crafting Items to hold those listed as crafting ingredients, and another Novelty Collectables article to hold the items that appear under the Misc tab, ie Teddy Bear. Of course another solution is to check with Dave on that, but it'll be best to sort out any details here first. -- Grexx 19:09, 2 January 2010 (UTC)

That could work. We could sort the Novelty Collectibles article like it's done in MH inventory.. Like have sections for gifts, misc, and crafting. Also I like your idea of also putting the "craftable" items on the crafting page, with a note saying it's uncertain how they will be used. Is it ok that the novelty collectibles that are also used for crafting will appear twice- once on each page? -- Doogleface 2:22, 3 January 2010 (UTC)

Created page at Novelty Collectibles (note spelling) -- Doogleface 15:58, 3 January 2010 (UTC)

Please avoid creating pages that contain little more than an introduction... I know it can be fun getting something out first, but it would have been better to have created such an article in your personal sandbox so it can be at least more partially completed before it is introduced. As it stands, the name itself is incorrect. We default to the format that the game developers typically use if there are any conflicts, since that's what most players would see. That's fine though, because we would have needed a redirect on that naming either ways. I have since made a temporary redirect to Crafting Items while it is being worked on.

More importantly, the layout hasn't exactly been ironed out, most details are outstanding, and no one currently seems to have the time or inclination to work on the article. I'll try to list out the basic outline of a page so at least the discussion can go along those lines, rather than drifting around.

Back to the order of the day, a brief outline of how we can handle the various novelty items.

1. Teddy Bears and related items are quite direct, and should be placed directly into Novelty Collectables, along with a writeup stating that whether they work or not is best left to the player's imagination (or similar).
2. While Teddy Bear appears under the Misc tab, and Slap Cat & such under the Gifts tab, they are essentially the same. It was just a quick sub-categorization by the developers, since Icing Sugar appears under Gifts too, even though most are probably from loot (gifts from mice? :D). Hence there is no need to differentiate between the two, other than to mention where they appear under.
3. It also has to be decided if the items should be in table form, similar to Cheese, or with each item getting its own section, similar to Maps and Keys. Personally I think a table would suffice, since there isn't really that much variation between the various items.

While novelty items that appear in the Gifts and Misc tab can be safely placed into Novelty Collectables, items that appear under the Crafting tab need to be kept within Crafting Items in my opinion, to avoid confusion.

1. Items that appear in the Gift tab should be placed into a new section called 'Novelty Items', under Crafting Items. I find this the most logical since most of the Gift items still appear under the crafting drop-down list, and will help players clear up any confusion about the usage.
2. Items that appear in the Gift tab, and that have a known crafting use, will continue to be kept under Crafting Items#Event Limited Crafting Items.
3. The introduction to the Novelty Items section should mention that these items are just collectables, and are not expected to be used in any form of crafting.

Let me know your thoughts on the layout. If there aren't any major disagreements, the general framework can be used directly. -- Grexx 16:26, 4 January 2010 (UTC)

Good outline Grexx. My chief concern is how to distinguish Novelty Collectables from other interesting but currently useless items. Will all the items offered as gifts end up in this page? I agree items like Teddy Bear belong there, but what about the Gold Bar? Christmas Coal? Icing Sugar? I think they have to be looked at on an item-by-item basis. Who would try to collect icing sugar? Nobody. Christmas coal? Probably some. Gold Bar? Lots of people. Greeting Card? Maybe. It's a hard line to draw, but I don't think anyone would be upset if we erred on including too many items in the list. I would try to make the page/table on my own, but I'm currently 0 for 1 on page creations and I think I should leave it to someone with more experience. -- Doogleface 18:09, 4 January 2010 (UTC)

According to the outline by Grexx above, items like Gold Bar and Christmas Coal will remain in crafting Items within (new) "Novelty Items" section. These are the gift items that still appear in the crafting drop-down menus, though they've been identified by devs as solely collectables with no practical use. Items like Icing Sugar will remain in Crafting Items#Event Limited Crafting Items because these are gifts that have a known crafting use. -- Camomiletea 18:20, 4 January 2010 (UTC)

Thanks for the clarification Camomiletea :) Something else I missed out is the Smashed Teddy Bear. As I don't have one myself, I won't be able to verify, but it should follow the guidelines as mentioned above. If it appears under the crafting tab, then it should belong under the 'Novelty Items' section within 'Crafting Items'. It currently doesn't appear within Crafting Items, so I'm unsure about this.

Anyways Doogleface, I wouldn't worry too much about making mistakes, we all do. No need to keep score, and don't be put off by your own mistakes. It is whether we learn from them that is important :) I made a good number of them myself when I first started working on the MH Wiki, and I still do occasionally, but they typically get fixed fast enough. That's the really strong point about wikis, where anyone can keep an eye on what is added, removed or changed.

Also, I wouldn't worry too much about where each item goes. Once they are actually placed into the areas as discussed, any discrepancies typically become very obvious, and can be rectified there and then. This is better than spending time debating about it and getting nothing done. -- Grexx 18:54, 4 January 2010 (UTC)

I've put it up into Novelty Collectibles as mentioned under naming. Feel free to edit anything that needs improvement. -- Grexx 16:53, 15 January 2010 (UTC)

Naming

Ok, I just noticed there's some inconsistency over the way developers are calling the Novelty Collectables/Collectibles. Under the gifts tab, they are termed as fun collectibles. I'll be switching to using Novelty Collectibles as the main article rather than Novelty Collectables since that should logically be the word that most players would see more frequently. Dave's post about Novelty Collectables wouldn't be seen by as many players over the course of time. But either ways, not particularly important since one variant will be redirected to the other. Just wanted to put down the thought process lol. -- Grexx 18:40, 13 January 2010 (UTC)

Gold Brick Image

Current image looks like it has been resized. File format is also wrong. Appreciate if someone can upload the original file. -- Grexx 17:56, 14 January 2010 (UTC)

Uploaded. Pus 19:27, 14 January 2010 (UTC)